Very off topic here but I've seen you guys post about cars and the such so thought I'd pick ur brain.

I'm looking at two cars. 2006 Acura TSX and 2007 Toyota Camry LE. I've test drove both and of course I like the Acura a lot more. The Camry is a very nice car for the money and it looks cool on the outside but I guess the Acura felt better. It was more fun to drive, more options, more luxury (kinda), very tight and accurate car is the only way to describe it. The Camry just kinda felt like any other car I've driven. Anyway thoughts on the two models? I know they are kinda two very different monsters but

Now for the games the salesliars play. I talked to the Acura dealer first. Basically a 06 TSX sticker price is $28,505. I told the guy I have no trade in (which is a lie) and that I have my own financing. First off the guy kept demanding to know which bank I am going through and the rate. I told him it is not of his concern or business. He said he needed to know and I kept saying no you do not. He then went on this whole speel on how he can get me a better rate, blah blah. And I cut him off and said please lets talk numbers. He still insisted on me taking the loan through them. Finally I told him if he can beat 5.99% I would consider. So after some wasted time he came back and said they could do 6.15% (or something I can't remember) and I said forget it and let's continue with the figures. He kept pressing on the financing… FINALLY he gave me a quoted price of $26,800. Out the door price (tax and rip off conveyance fee) is $28,700. Then I threw in I did have a 2001 Chevy Tracker LE 4WD w/leather for trade. He got real mad. He said I should have told him right from the start I had a trade. He said since its getting late we'd have to continue this tomorrow. But he said trade in value would be about $6,000. I said $7,400 and he just said I have to talk to my manager and review the figures. It was late so I said fine call me.

I'm going to another dealer to see if the price is the same but how do you play these games with these people? Any hints or suggestions? Its such a hassle I almost want to forget it! I am in no rush to buy a new car but it would be nice to have one for the summer.

My only advice, don't buy american cars. For some reason american cars have more problems than imports.

i know, my friend had a FORD and he said it was the worst purchase of his life. Another guy at work had a Chevy sedan and again, said it had a lot of probs. Then again a girl i work with has a VW Jetta that she is having electrical issues big time. I came to the conclusion jap cars seem to be on the top in regards to reliability and fit and finish.

SteveOTB said:

Not if you take care of them. Imports (mainly Jap cars) seem like they last longer, but most people don't keep up with the regular maintenance. Jap cars handle this abuse better than American cars. If you keep up with all that care, the American car will out last the imports hands down. It also depends on which brands and makes you are comparing.

Car salesmen are trained to throw tons of numbers at you to get you confused (hence the whole finance thing). As soon as you are, his deals will seem good, but you're getting stiffed. Your best bet is to take all quotes on paper (make sure they are itemized) and review them at home. Make sure to check the math and then choose.

that's the kicker, he WILL NOT write ANYTHING DOWN ON PAPER. so frustrating!

FORD = Frequently Often Repaired or Dies

Found On Road Dead
Fix Or Repair Daily
Factory Ordered Road Disaster

For Only Retarded Drivers

Tell him you won't deal with him if he doesn't... He'll change his tune.

FORD=Fucking Owner Really Dumb

all of my cars thus far

1985 ford tempo: got with 120K, collapsed at 175K
uner $2000 in repairs over 4 years
cost: $600

1977 buick regal: got with 35K, refused to move at um.. 79K
no repairs behind plugs and distributor cap: 2.5 years
cost: $300

1996 saturn: got with 39.9K, traded in at 225K
probably $1500 in repairs over 5 years
cost: $5,000

2005 honda civic hybrid: bought new.
about $1000 in "maintenance" over a little over a year.. ep!
cost: $18,800

buy American said:

I was trying to remember "Fixed Or Repaired Daily" but I couldn't remember it so I improvised.

DALE, THAT'S A FAIT!

yeah i'll tell him he has to put everything on paper and be specific. i'll see what happens. i want to see how the trade in effects the price. i always hear they mess with the numbers when you trade in making you feel like you got a good deal.

the finance thing was funny, the guy would not let up. i was about to just yell at him to shut up!

Cheap
Heap
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Valve
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Or
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Every
Time

Acura Man said:

He gets extra commission if you finance through the dealership.

no diss to american cars but i just find the foreign cars looking better and they really do handle better. american pick up trucks, well that is a different story.

but how do i know what is a fair price on this car? go to edmunds.com?

Go to kbb.com and look up the car you want to buy. Like the acura TSX (2006), the dealer gets the car for $ 26,051.00, and they are looking to sell it for about $ 28,505.00. Try to talk him into something around $ 27,500.

thanks man of the century!

1990 ford brono II, orig. engine tranny everything 282K and still strong

fuck everyone who says american and fords dont last. i take care of mine and look at in now fuckers

[Jun 1,2006 10:32am - the_reverend]
DALE, THAT'S A FAIT!

Fix it again Tony
Nice King of the Hill reference.

anonymous said:

I have a 1998 Chevy C1500 pick-up. I bought it 3 years ago with 78k miles. It now has 168k miles and still runs like its brand new. Its all in how much care you put into the car/truck.

Your's is more impressive though...

i wont have anything to do with imports. i think Ford is one of, if not the best car manufacturer around. i have never had any bad luck with a Ford, only if i didnt take care of a problem. jap cars take more abuse, but everything breaks in them. i dislike Dodge, but Pontiac makes a decent car. its all about Ford though. well my Ford Crown Vic 2 Door LTD. best car ever.

I sold cars for a living for 4 years while I was in school. I hate to say it dude, but you are the liar and scum in this situation. You held back your trade (lied) and asked for his best price...he gave you their best price (honest) which is probably closed to wholesale. If you want to bicker on price, go buy a Hyundai.....this is an Acura you're talking about....a hard enough car to get as it is. Then you pop the trade on him and expect more than wholesale for it?? It's a TRACKER dude....softer than a sneaker full of dogshit in the market....and not exactly a desirable vehicle for a dealer to re-sell. Trackers run like shit at auction because nobody wants them and you want how much for it?!?! After all of the lying that you did to this guy, and wasting his time to boot, which he has to use wisely in order to pay his bills....you're lucky he didn't punch you in the face.....or tell you to get the hell out of the dealership.

The problem is the consumer, not the salespeople. Car buyers make the process of buying a car more difficult than it should EVER be.

If you want an easy process.....pay sticker, they'll roll out the red carpet for you. Until then.....be honest and stop playing games. They want to sell it, you want to buy it....now why fuck around with all of the lies??

hoser said:

Hey man!!!! I told you to resend your address!!!!

what, 13.. 14 times?

out of all ford products i have owned...the ones with the most problems are the imported ones. anything with a V8 that was american was amazing. both of my wagons, all 3 of the town cars my family has owned, and all of the american wagons my family has owned. we got a car for free, a mercury zephyr wagon... 4.2 v8... we expected the car to last a year tops.... we had it for 5 and it never steered us wrong. over 200k on it. 85 town car... 300K+ on the odometer and NO rebuild on the engine... it was beat the fuck out of by the previous owner, was in 4 accidents in the same spot and drove like a champ until we junked it for a newer town car. 5.0 engines LAST. i have never seen another engine, in person, thats as dependable as a ford 5.0... it will take abuse all day and start upi fine for you anyday of the year. so if you wanna rag on american cars... rag on chrysler.

Dear Acuraman,
I really hope this works out for you. I don't won't to see you around here next week as ChevyTrackerdude.

hoser, i am only looking out for myself. I've negotiated mainly through email to 4 dealerships. Only walked into one. The guy just called me and said $7000 on my Tracker. Went in to talk some more and get this he had the car i was looking at parked right in front and when i sat down had the PPW for me to review. I didn't want to buy it today as I am in no rush. I looked over the PPW and noticed he added $250 for window etching, and a couple more thousand for warranty, special coating for rust protection, added insurance, etc.etc.etc. i told him i did not want to buy it and that i am still working with other dealers (going to look into the camry now). So the guy got upset but i told him i wanted the deal written on their letter head. so he did it. trade in done seperatley and a break down on the car with none of these added options... they have 9 TSX models in their lot but he said they they will go fast, etc... i'll make a decision by July. thanks for all the comments.

TheGreatSpaldino said:

my crown vic has a 302 in it, and that thing has taken some decent abuse and fires right up every day, cold or hot. i had an F-250 that had been beaten straight to hell, and the only reason it died was because the wire harness caught fire. the engine still ran. the only engine i ever blew was in an 86 Camaro i had. that thing was a fucking heap. but, it wasnt a Ford.

i've driven mostly subarus when i first started driving. first couple cars all had over 300k on them and they all died of course. on one the brakes gave out, another the headgasket blew and on another the fuel pump went. i still consider subaru decent cars though...these ones all had long lives. one thing i hate about imports is they're so hard to work on. subaru pretty much hides everything. i know next to nothing about cars but i can still change my oil, spark plugs and filters and all the belts on my ford. subaru is a different story. i had my neighbor help me replace the timing chain on a 3 cylander subaru justy and that fucker took 8 hours.

so basically...with imports it's harder to find garages that will work on them, but with ford or chevy every mechanic can fix.